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from RIP magazine, November 1990
[I interviewed Mike Muir several times over the course of my journalistic career, but my biggest memory of him is the time I bummed him out. It was at the CMJ convention (at least I think it was CMJ — some New York music convention, in any case) and I forget which year it was — whichever year Mike was on an artists' panel with Ace Frehley. I spent that particular convention hanging out a lot with the Epic staff — publicist Hanna Bolte (now Hanna Pantle, at BMI) and the label's metal team, Mike Schnapp and Brian Lima. In fact, I roomed with Hanna for at least one night, and she was staying in the same hotel as Muir, who was one of the artists she was working with. So here was Mike on this panel, griping loudly about the music business, as he was wont to do. And in the middle of his tirade, Ace Frehley looked over at him and said, "What's wrong, Mike? You sound really unhappy. Maybe you should take a look at that." And amazingly, Mike had absolutely no comeback! I'd never seen anyone shut Mike up like that, ever. Mike never did fully recover during the course of the panel. That evening, Hanna, Mike Schnapp, Mike Muir and I were all supposed to have dinner, so we stopped at Muir's room to get him. As we were heading for the hotel elevator, I made one — just one! — offhanded comment about Ace Frehley and Mike stopped in his tracks. "Ah man, I changed my mind," he whined. "I don't want to go to dinner." And no amount of cajoling from the rest of us would make him come along. Like a big baby, he headed back to his room. No matter — Hanna, Schnapp and I went out and had a great time without him. Needless to say, the interview below happened sometime before Mike's unfortunate Ace Frehley encounter.]
"This is your good friend, Mike Muir."
The voice on the other end of the line was positively dripping with sarcasm. I rolled my eyes but I couldn't help smiling into the receiver. I had already crossed paths with Suicidal Tendencies' sharply imposing frontman on several occasions, and it was just like him to throw a dig at the phony friendliness of the music industry before we even started talking. This was the first of several chats I was to have with Mike for this article, and while he may not exactly be a good friend of mine, I can say I admire and respect him, even though he can be a bit overbearing at times.
For example, we couldn't even talk about last year's European tour with Anthrax without Mike jumping on my case. "That's a weird bill," I suggested, "because Anthrax is a radically different band from you guys."
"In what way?" Mike's tone was challenging, defensive and downright snotty.
Naturally I began to stammer. "They're um, ah, more, uh — I'm trying to say they're more cheerful than you guys are!"
"Oh, we're quite cheerful people," he insisted.
"No, you're not!" I protested.
"What do you mean, 'No'?"
"You're always feeling like shit!" My comment was in reference to last year's EP, Feel Like Shit... Deja Vu.
"Oooohhhh," groaned Mike, "see if I put you on my Christmas card list! That'll teach you!"
I was starting to wonder if we were ever gonna get this interview underway, but I needn't have worried. Once Mike starts "talking shit," as he likes to put it, there's no stopping him. He was more than eager to discuss the problems the record company had with releasing that EP.
"They tried to say, 'Well, we're gonna put Feel Like S**t on it,'" Mike harumphed, "and I said, 'No, that's bullshit. It's not Feel Like S**t. It's Feel Like Shit.' And they go, 'Well, none of the stores will carry it. What's the point of putting it out?' I said, 'If you're worried, don't put it out!'" Of course, Mike wound up having the title the way he wanted, and without major promotion, or being carried in many retail chains, the record sold well enough to chart in Billboard.
Perhaps part of the reason that Suicidal has built up such as strong underground following is because Mike's lyrics are as blunt and forceful as his demeanor. "People try to say, 'Oh, feel like shit, that's deep,'" he complained. "Well, what am I supposed to say? 'Oh, my cosmic lines are intertwined with the planetary thing and this and that?' What are you supposed to use, poetry? You ask the question, you get an answer. Why go through all the bullshit?" And as for those who don't like the way he feels, "They should be saying, 'What's the problem?' Not like, 'Hey, you can't say that! That's not right!' What do you mean, that's not right! You've never been in my life, so don't tell me how I should feel."
Those who cringe at the occasional use of a four-letter word are guaranteed to have a coronary over ST's new album, Lights... Camera... Revolution. These songs shove themselves down your throat with no holds barred, and Mike tells you, in no uncertain terms, exactly why he feels so damn shitty. But I'm getting a little ahead of myself here. At the time of this particular talk, the band had just laid down tracks for 31 songs. "We might do a triple album," he suggested, adding mysteriously, "You never know when it's your last record."
The songs eventually got pared down to ten, and I highly doubt that this will be the band's last album. "I'm just too stubborn," Mike asserted, "and I know too many people would be happy if Suicidal Tendencies stopped. There's certain people I ain't gonna let off the hook that easy." My major doubt was Mike's claim that, "We're a kinder, gentler band nowadays." When I told him I found that hard to believe, he stressed, "See, our definition of kinder and gentler is probably different than other people's." Now that I could buy.
After all, Mike affirms that "people want you to be passive. I'm not a passive person." And there's a purpose behind ST's aggression. "Suicidal, it's all about living," is a phrase familiar to the band's fans. The singer elaborated: "I look at a lot of people and, yeah, their hearts are beating, and their minds are supposedly working, but I don't think that's living. And it goes deeper. There are people that have got their lives in this pattern, and they're not happy, but that's all they know, and they're too afraid to make a change. For us, failure's not in trying something and it not working out — failing's in when you don't try doing something that you want to do."
If that's the case, then, musically, Suicidal is a highly successful outfit. "The bottom line is, we're doing what we want to do," Mike firmly states. "I never got heavy 'cause I wanted to sell records, 'cause I wanted my ugly face on the cover of a magazine." The fact that the quintet has not yet gained widespread acceptance has nothing to do with its sound. "For instance, our last record," Mike reasoned, "if that wasn't Suicidal Tendencies, and if that was a new band with a different name, and we were straight-out five white guys with long hair and spandex, I really believe it would have done better. And I'm not the only person that says that."
Maybe Lights... Camera... Revolution will break through the image barrier. Several months later, when I got the tape, it fried my speakers. "You Can't Bring Me Down" was the ultimate ST statement, its anger and frustration delivered full force. "Alone" was a deeply moving study in alienation, and "Send Me Your Money" showed Mike's humor at its snidest. I had an interview scheduled with Mike and innovative guitarist Rocky George at the studio where a few of the tracks were being remixed, but unfortunately, not three days before, Rocky wrapped his car around a pole and wound up in the hospital. He had broken five ribs and his sternum. As soon as Mike assured me that Rocky — an all-around good guy and pal of the RIP staff — was going to be okay, he decided to put me on the spot again.
"What really interests me about the record...." I started to say, but before I could finish, Mike shot at me, "How much have you heard of it, straight out?"
This time I was prepared for him. "I've heard the whole record all the way through twice, and I've heard a couple of the songs more than that, because I wanted to go back and listen to them."
"Okay."
"You wanted to make sure? You testing me?" I demanded. Well, why not fight fire with fire?
"No, no, no."
With that out of the way, we got down to business. The making of Lights... Camera... Revolution wasn't easy for ST. "With this record," explained Mike, "it was a situation where there was twice, straight out — once when everyone left the studio and once when I left — that we said, 'That's it. It ain't worth it.'" The pressure didn't have as much to do with the band and the recording as it did with the prevailing attitudes of the record industry. That's what really gets to this uncompromising bunch. And not only does Mike hate the wimpiness and hypocrisy of the business in general, he's also not too fond of his so-called peers in the metal world. "I won't be hanging out with none of those people, because I don't like them!" he snarled. "They're way more phony than the punk-rock people, who I used to think were the most hypocritical people in the world. It's funny, because rock 'n' roll, they always have, 'Oh, we're rebels, party, this and that,' but they act just like politicians — they're doing interviews, saying all the right things, trying to look the right way. Basically, they all look stupid to me. One of the problems, I think, with most people, it’s like, they're gonna be rock stars, but they're so worried about how they are. What happens when they're' 35 and 40, and they're fat and bald, and no one gives a shit about them anymore? You know, it's the old romance to replace the lack of one's self."
Suicidal's attitude, when it went in to record, said Mike, "wasn't like, 'Oh, how many records do we have to sell to recoup?' It was, 'I'm gonna do this record, and if it offends people, it offends people. And if people say Suicidal's shocking or horrifying, well, the truth is shocking. Honesty's horrifying.'" And Mike stands proudly by the statements made in the album. "I believe in this record more than anything we did."
A month later, when Rocky had recovered enough to sit down with me, he reaffirmed Mike's comments. "I personally think this is a really good album, our best one," the guitarist said. "Maybe it'll open up these people's minds, make them look past the way we look and what we used to do."
Naturally, Mike walked in and out several times during our talk at the Epic offices and couldn't help putting his two cents' worth in. "I'm going to interject, and pat Rocky on the back," he grinned. "Rocky had a lot more influence on the songwriting on this, and that's really a very strong point. Now, I'll get out of here." As he headed for the door, he added, "Rocky's too modest, that's his problem. And I guess if Mike would let him talk sometimes...."
As usual, Mike was right. When I asked Rocky why he hadn't contributed to the songwriting before, he shrugged. "When I joined, on Join the Army, a lot of stuff was already done, and on the last album, Clark," the band's other guitarist, "had stuff in. And some of it has to do with being a little lazy." He smiled. "I write a lot of different things, and sometimes they don't fit. I get kinda out there sometimes."
Although Rocky's attitude is more laid back than Mike's - and he had to be even more laid back to recover from his accident — he shares a lot of Mike's opinions about the band. "People are scared to like us, 'cause they're afraid of what someone else is going to think," Rocky said, frowning mildly. "That doesn't make sense."
Another thing that is incomprehensible to him - and to just about everyone else - is why Suicidal hasn't been allowed to play in its hometown of L.A. for several years. "We've never had any problems," he said of the Suicidal shows. "No one's gotten killed, like I can say about some bands. There's been no riots. I don't know what everyone's worried about. It's just crazy. It seemed like going out on tour and having a clean record would satisfy everyone, but it doesn't. They go, 'Well, this is L.A., and this is where all your friends are.' What sense is that?"
The bottom line for Rocky, however, is, "I like to talk with my guitar, and do that most of the time." Check out some of his wildly psychotic solos on Lights... Camera... Revolution, and it becomes clear that he's one of the most underrated metal-style guitarists. As a whole, Suicidal Tendencies has been underrated. These guys make strong statements, both musically and lyrically, and for their effort, they've been spit on, dissed and banned. No wonder Mike gets down and talks shit. And in his own twisted way, Mike promised me there's more to come.
"One day, if it all goes well, I'll have my chance to talk serious shit," he assured me. "Ain't nobody who can talk shit better than I can. And it'll be worth it when I have my chance. Then I can walk right off my white-spotted horse into the sunset and disappear. People will call out, 'We need you, Mike!' not knowing how to get me. And I will shock the world one more time." Then, after a dramatic pause, he proclaimed, "A modern-day hero! A kinder and gentler hero!"
Ah yes, behind the face of stone lies a heart of gold.
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